tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post7074978999993930585..comments2024-03-19T00:05:10.332+05:30Comments on Parimala Hariprasad: Serve your StakeholderParimala Hariprasadhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15304352526906191995noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-67476804727798529252010-04-15T10:27:13.845+05:302010-04-15T10:27:13.845+05:30@Parthi
In my opinion we cannot group all such gr...<i> @Parthi<br /><br />In my opinion we cannot group all such groups of people into one large category as Stakeholders. As the groups that are listed above may not have the same kind of interest. Few that I could think are<br />• Stakeholder – Owns the program/project/product and have financial/non-financial impacts of the fallouts <br />• Facilitators – Help and support but do not own it <br />• Consumers – May or may not own it but certainly consume the benefit </i><br /><br />As per Dr.Cem’s definition, stakeholder is someone who has a vested interest in the success of the testing effort and/or in the success of the product. Facilitators and Consumers belong to the latter category of success of the product. Anybody who has some stake with the product directly or indirectly is a stakeholder in some form. <br /><br /><i> Serving the users may not always be possible but what is more important is to know the domain/nature of the software supposed to serve (as quoted by Cem) </i><br /><br />We try hard to solve problems around serving the users better. Isn’t it? Just to paraphrase, you say that domain knowledge of the software is very important for the tester which is important.<br /><br /><i> In a service based/oriented software development process, we speak to stakeholders (in my experience 99.9 times out of 100) who represent the users</i><br /><br />Speaking to stakeholders is a first good step. However, do you think you would have spoken to all the stakeholders of the software? You take a small sample among the stakeholders to do this exercise. This will be very useful, but definitely not good enough to find all defects in the software [Complete Testing is impossible]. <br /><br /><i> a program manager who runs the software development show, a business analyst who tries to decipher the user’s mind and so on</i><br /><br />Depending upon the program manager or business analyst’s caliber and skill set, we could try to decipher the user’s mind. The more the number of people who attempt this, the more shocking the revelations can be. It would not be good to assume that they are the best folks. They might be good enough.<br /><br /><i> In this case, we as tester will never get to hear the *real* users until the software is out in the street </i><br /><br />I disagree. I would replace ‘will never get to hear’ with ‘may not get to hear’. It is however, possible to know provided the tester is interested to find out. <br /><br /><i> I do agree to an extend that as testers we should think like users, but it’s not just the users we should try to think-like, rather all the different groups playing different roles. I think that’s the handiest contribution as a tester we make to the entire project/product development process, i.e. “Role Play” </i><br /><br />Well said. Testers need to play diversified roles to be able to provide quality related information better.<br /><br /><br />Thanks for your time in detailing out your thoughts,<br />Regards,<br />Parimala ShankaraiahParimala Hariprasadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15304352526906191995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-73835206497993983642010-04-12T20:02:56.337+05:302010-04-12T20:02:56.337+05:30@Parthi
Help me to understand 'stakeholders&#...@Parthi<br /><br />Help me to understand 'stakeholders' and who are they.<br /><br /><i><br />In my opinion we cannot group all such groups of people into one large category as Stakeholders. As the groups that are listed above may not have the same kind of interest. Few that I could think are<br />• Stakeholder – Owns the program/project/product and have financial/non-financial impacts of the fallouts<br />• Facilitators – Help and support but do not own it<br />• Consumers – May or may not own it but certainly consume the benefit<br />Serving the users may not always be possible but what is more important is to know the domain/nature of the software supposed to serve (as quoted by Cem). This can sound synonym to stakeholder/user but in my opinion these are two different. One is the *concept* and the other is the *consumer*. Understanding one or the other is key to the success of the project. Knowledge of the *concept* and interaction with *consumer* is ideal<br /></i><br /><br />1. What does 'stake' mean?<br />2. What does 'stakeholders' mean? <br />3. When can we see or group them as or they appear as stakeholders?<br />4. When we cannot group as or cannot see them as or they do not appear as stakeholders?<br />5. What we understand for word 'stakeholder' in context software project?<br />6. Who is a stakeholder in context of software project? How can we conclude they are stakeholders and they are not stakeholders? How far the conclusion made is accepted and not accepted and why?<br /><br /><br /><b>Scenario</b>: A farmer cultivates paddy. Now who consumes this paddy as a rice? Who will work with farmer to cultivate the crop? Who assisted farmer to do agriculture and how? Where, when, why and how did they assist farmer? Are they using rice of this farmer? The other people who farmer does not know and who did not assist her or him directly or indirectly, are they using rice of this farmer? Does farmer will use her or his own rice? Now who is a stakeholder here?<br /><br /><br />How can we relate above scenario to software development which includes testing too? Who is a stakeholder here? <br /><br />-<br />RavisuriyaRavisuriyanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-28573952651160312402010-04-09T01:52:54.032+05:302010-04-09T01:52:54.032+05:30Hi
Stakeholders could be project managers, mark...Hi <br /><br /><i><br />Stakeholders could be project managers, marketing managers, product managers, programmers, technical support representative, sales representatives, customers and many others in many different roles. Testing is done on behalf of the stakeholders <br /></i><br /><br />In my opinion we cannot group all such groups of people into one large category as Stakeholders. As the groups that are listed above may not have the same kind of interest. Few that I could think are<br />• Stakeholder – Owns the program/project/product and have financial/non-financial impacts of the fallouts <br />• Facilitators – Help and support but do not own it <br />• Consumers – May or may not own it but certainly consume the benefit <br />Serving the users may not always be possible but what is more important is to know the domain/nature of the software supposed to serve (as quoted by Cem). This can sound synonym to stakeholder/user but in my opinion these are two different. One is the *concept* and the other is the *consumer*. Understanding one or the other is key to the success of the project. Knowledge of the *concept* and interaction with *consumer* is ideal<br /><br />In a service based/oriented software development process, we speak to stakeholders (in my experience 99.9 times out of 100) who represent the users; a program manager who runs the software development show, a business analyst who tries to decipher the user’s mind and so on.<br /> <br /><b> A project where public website to be built for the potential investors across the world for an investment bank:</b> Here the *real* users range from the potential investor to casual browsers for information (of different age/country/background (knowledge level)) and I don’t think they have any interest in the software that’s being developed at all<br />In this case, we as tester will never get to hear the *real* users until the software is out in the street. Here the stakeholders presume what a user would want to see (information) and navigate. Then we mix the assumption with some standards of a web development like usability factor, application performance factor (which are assertions). <br /><br /><b> A typical product development process (say a trading system): </b> As designers/developers/testers (stakeholders), we have to understand the way market works and trades are generated (for all possible instruments and algorithms). Then this is mixed with the technical feasibilities/available trading algorithms, and some standards (again assertions) about the performance, usability. <br /><br />So here the design, development and so the testing is done not after talking to users but people who are user-like, then the product goes to market. <br /><br />I do agree to an extend that as testers we should think like users, but it’s not just the users we should try to think-like, rather all the different groups playing different roles. I think that’s the most handy contribution as a tester we make to the entire project/product development process, ie “Role Play”Parthihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00924350266773324488noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-29211023290268551392010-04-02T13:22:23.165+05:302010-04-02T13:22:23.165+05:30@Deven
Thank you for your kind words.
I have j...<i>@Deven </i><br /><br />Thank you for your kind words.<br /><br /><i> I have just registered on Weekend Testing and would love to be part of it soon </i><br /><br />Europe chapter might work well for your timezone. Looking forward to your participation.<br /><br /><i>And yes I am planning to start a blog of my own and would really help in getting some tips from you experts </i><br /><br />I am not an expert. It's a long way to go. It's infact a journey rather than a destination.<br /><br />Good to know you are about to blog. I would be glad to help. Do write in to me.<br /><br />Regards,<br />Parimala ShankaraiahParimala Hariprasadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15304352526906191995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-77291541525558469982010-04-02T13:11:25.762+05:302010-04-02T13:11:25.762+05:30Hi Parimala,
I have been following your blogs fro...Hi Parimala,<br /><br />I have been following your blogs from couple of weeks and must admit they are brilliant. It is by nature and also as a tester by profession that we tend to think about a mission by putting ourselves in the epicenter of that mission and thinking you would had done this and that and finding the same in your report makes yourself proud. I have just registered on Weekend Testing and would love to be part of it soon. And yes I am planning to start a blog of my own and would really help in getting some tips from you experts.<br /><br />Cheerz,<br />Deven B.<br />UK.DevenBairathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10209017878961208943noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-31767203353272360272010-04-02T09:13:50.647+05:302010-04-02T09:13:50.647+05:30@Dhanasekar S
No doubt, 3 Yo takes the highest pr...<i>@Dhanasekar S <br />No doubt, 3 Yo takes the highest priority,BTW how about 30 yo ;)</i><br /><br />Both are doing great. Thanks for asking :)<br /><br /><br /><i>@Issi Hazan-Fuchs<br />most the stakeholders which we as testers interface with are usually not the users themselves, but people which part of their role is to represent the users towards the development and test team </i><br /><br />True. I see this as one of the key problems as well. We should involve the 'real' stakeholders early and more often to get a clear picture. To some extent, What I do is to try and get different team members to brief exact customer flows and requirements based on prior implementations of the product. I don't really know how to get this done in any organization reasonably well. It would be good to listen to some stakeholder success stories.<br /><br />Regards,<br />Parimala ShankaraiahParimala Hariprasadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15304352526906191995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-78723748398735661752010-04-01T20:06:06.121+05:302010-04-01T20:06:06.121+05:30Hi Pari!
Allthough users are one type,of stakehold...Hi Pari!<br />Allthough users are one type,of stakeholders,and I liked to read this terminology in the mission statement, most the stakeholders which we as testers interface with are usualy not the users themselves, but people which part of their role is to represent the users towards the development and test team. <br />Helping the stakehpolders within the team to understand the User profiles is one one the things that defines a good tester, and I think you gave a great demonstartion of that.<br /><br />P.S. I'll better got back to spend some time with my 3,5 & 7 YO :-)Issi Hazan-Fuchshttp://testermindset.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-70858005216226187322010-04-01T11:32:47.155+05:302010-04-01T11:32:47.155+05:30No doubt, 3 Yo takes the highest priority,BTW how ...No doubt, 3 Yo takes the highest priority,BTW how about 30 yo ;)<br />--Dhanasekar SAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-48646739141045771312010-03-31T15:08:21.504+05:302010-03-31T15:08:21.504+05:30@ZXC8
Your report was very helpful
Wow. You see...<i>@ZXC8<br /><br />Your report was very helpful </i><br /><br />Wow. You seem to be another URL shortener company. Isn't it?<br /><br />I plan to do a Part II of this exercise if that helps you :)<br /><br />Thank you for your feedback because you are one of those rare souls who read my report and even acknowledged it :)<br /><br />Regards,<br />Parimala ShankaraiahParimala Hariprasadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15304352526906191995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2085771970779369940.post-72545405582910619302010-03-31T15:05:47.262+05:302010-03-31T15:05:47.262+05:30Your report wa very helpfulYour report wa very helpfulZXC9http://www.zxc9.comnoreply@blogger.com